IS IT TRUE September 27, 2013

1. “…we hope that our elected leaders will put their Tom Terrific thinking caps on and develop a competitive proposal for IU that offers several locations within the City of Evansville?”

   AB-SO-FREAKING-LUTELY!!!

   Congrats and thanks to CCO for stepping up to the plate on the hotel issue, and on the first of many record-breaking weeks I’m sure will follow.

2. Joe, I’m glad that I can give you something to write about. If you’re going to report something tell the whole story. You know that I am the one that wrote the response to your post about the “Nos” changing their position and I also wrote a post on their page, which I’m sure that you read. I will always stand behind the fact that I think that there was a value in doing the project at $37.5 million and it’s an even better value at $20 million which was attained by the council members announcing their dissention. I know that the number has been publicly changed to $38.5 on the original deal, but do the math for the reductions in the last week and we should be at $21, right. It was $37.5 and always has been. No point in arguing over $1 million though. Stories like this are why I called CCO a tabloid and said that you are tearing the community apart. If you are a true journalist, report the whole story not just the parts that fit your narrative.

   • Phyllip, you have been one of the most open to discussions all along. This was not directed at you or your comment. It is directed at the peanut gallery that are diminishing the savings. The $38.5 Million number was in the original resolution and included the cost of the bonding. The new one will be not to exceed $20 Million so the savings are after all at least $18.5 Million. Call the CCO whatever you adoring fans tell you to, but the fact remains that the CCO, the Against page, and six prudent city council members saved this town $18.5 Million. Without a cognizant challenge, you and your team would have signed on the dotted line for a $38.5 Million subsidy and you know it. And no, that would not have been a good deal and you know it. It would also never have passed. Thank us for the deal, thank us for the $18.5 Million and stop the rhetoric.

   • Facebook pages and websites slamming individual thought are not part of tearing the community apart? When someone questions anything around here it is always followed by accusations of hater, refuse change, the usual nay sayer and so on. Questions are exactly how change begins.

     • Obviously, you’ve never been on my page. Joe, can vouch for my appreciation for open dialogue. I never hide from a debate and I never think less of someone because our opinions differ. Go to http://www.facebook.com/evansvillesaysyes and find a post where I have insulted someone for having a dissenting opinion. I’ll admit that I get frustrated but I always try to stay above the fray of juvenile namecalling in my role as an admin. When I felt like saying something that I did not want to be considered as the page’s opinion or statement, I would post as myself.

       • I will indeed vouch for Phyllip allowing open dialog. He even banned some supporters whose comments got ugly. I found myself going to his site often to stir the pot. The end result is that there will be a convention hotel and some new apartments downtown and the TIF should be able to afford it. As painful as the process may have become, the end result is very positive. Phyllip was a contributor to this process and I hope to see the end result become a model for future economic development projects. If it took some folks calling us a “laughing stock of the Midwest” to get to this point then so be it. Last weeks laughing stock is now the “envy of the Midwest” for the creative way the private sector was brought into the deal. This flying circus should be a case study for others to emulate going forward. Sometimes a good fight results in great results. We thank Phyllip for the opportunity of open dialog even when some of his “likes” were not on the same page he was on.

   • Sorry Phyllip, You never came across to me as anything but a worshiper at the throne of Political Power, and Money. The Fact that you still feel your view on the issue cannot be faulted, after $18+ million dollars of Bonded debt, has been lifted off the backs of the people, and their children, by the diligence of the CCO, the Council, and the opposition, to a “Bad” deal, points to nothing more than narcissism on your part, and relegates you to the dust of Evansville’s history when it comes to the realized value of your view concerning responsible stewardship, or anything else for that matter.–Sad, but, evidently you haven’t learned a thing. After reading your post here, one can conclude, your future seemingly holds nothing, but the promise of worn out knees on all of your “I’m a Big Boy Now” breeches.

     • Right, Phyllip has put himself in the position of being thought of as a nicer version of Della.

       • I have not intentionally put myself in a position to be viewed in any manner, because the only ones that opinions of me matter to me are: my family, my God and myself. I try to be as kind to people when discussing politics because I try to assume positive intent in others. I hope that we all truly want what’s best for our community. The hotel issue is basically two sides speculating different futures. Research will always be flawed on both sides because both sides are looking to support their arguments. You can get a lot more done in life with a positive outlook. I know that most on this page will disagree with that. Here’s the kicker. I used to be just like you. My life improved tremendously when I started volunteering and participating in the growth of my community. I have no desire to ever rum for political office because I would have to sacrifice my identity and opinion. As to anyone that calls me a coward, I would kindly ask them to say it to me in person.

     • I’ll end it at this. Until you are man or woman enough to use your real name and not be a coward slinging crap behind a pseudonym, your opinion does not matter to me. There’s only a handful of people that have the balls to use their real names on here and I commend them for that. Brad, Joe, Wayne and myself are the only people on here that I would even consider their opinion. If you want to discuss it like an adult, I’ll be at the City Council meeting on Monday. I’m never very hard to find. Ask Brad, he’ll point me out.

       • I want to introduce myself to you, Phyllip. My name is Laura K. Blackburn. I use my initials written out to post, just because it is a “nickname” given to me by some former co-workers. Most of the Courier regulars know me and often address me as “Laura”.
         I agree with you, for the most part, about having the courage of one’s convictions. Unfortunately, there are some people who actually stoop so low as to make threats to those who do not see things the way they do.
         That being said, I absolutely can’t believe that you think that this hotel was a good deal at the first figure. I don’t see any great success in the future of the venture, but I am willing to go along because I think the bickering will harm our reputation more than the loss of money involved.
         We need to start moving ahead to pursue the IU Medical School, with a variety of solid plans and choices, in my opinion.

       • Phyllip
         Look in the mirror if you want to see the coward , say you won’t even consider my opinion cause I use a screen name on here ? A coward is someone who caves into authority and let’s people give them their opinion
         I’m a free man , I pay taxes and have always worked hard jobs
         Not a dam thing was ever given to me cause I was man enough to go out and earn it and buy stuff with my money,,,our previous mayor and the one before do not care about taxpayers they only want their money and will stoop very low to get it
         Nothing personal my friend , just business
         DONT TREAD ON ME OR MY MONEY
         E

         • Meant to say previous and current mayors
           My bad

         • Sorry to bust your bubble but free men and women do not pay taxes. Taxes go for things like killing people and whole countries like Iraq are destroyed. Taxpayers foot this bill because they are ignorant. Which also makes them complicit in those crimes. Every thing you need to know to repent and become a non-taxpayer can be found here.
           http://www.supremelaw.org/fedzone11/index.htm

       • Phyllip,

         Something for you to consider is some of us (myself included) do business with the city/county and it would be business suicide to post our real names along with a dissenting comment, if you haven’t learned by now Evansville politics is full of paybacks for having a dissenting opinion or point of view.

         JMHO

       • No Problem,–My Name is Terry Rickard, I’m a 70yr old male, a father of 4 daughters and lifelong resident of Evansville. I have recently moved to Warrick County, and have my home in Evansville up for sale, when it sells, I hope to move to South Carolina.–I will not miss Evansville’s Political creeps, and their concubines, whom I ridicule at every opportunity. I believe my opinions are of little consequence in the “small” picture that is Evansville. Get over yourself, your opinions are worth what mine are,–nothing, just rain drops falling in a small pond full of pseudo “big fish”.—sincerely, Crash

         • Terry–I wish you did not feel that way. Your opinions do mean a lot. The problem is most people do not get involved like you do. I wish more people were active. I hope the activity is along the lines of Republican beliefs/principles but even if one support the democrat concepts, I encourage people to be active. You cannot win every battle, but we will have better government if more people got involved with the issues.

           Good luck in S Carolina.

         • Crash, we are gonna miss you. Stay engaged and enjoy South Carolina. I am certain that there are some SNEGAL activities going on in the Palmetto state that you can apply tar and feathers too. Here is a link to a CCO type publication down there. Their motto is “unfair and imbalanced”. http://www.fitsnews.com/

   • ” I will always stand behind the fact that I think that there was a value in doing the project at $37.5 million…”

     The drug addict never wants to admit he has a problem either, but he is nonetheless a drug addict. The original deal was a horrible one. This latest one, though worlds better, is still not perfect.

     The sad thing is, if not for the “yes we can” crowd negotiating against themselves and with HCW, we could have gotten an even better deal with an even better prognosis of long term survival. Your group made and better deal politically impossible. It’s sad you are so smart, yet cannot see that.

   • Your comment utilizes the word “I” nine times. Do you really think anyone is interested in you? It is quite apparent that you are your own biggest fan.

     Joe responded “laying you low” without mentioning himself a single time.

     That is the difference between an egoist and a realist.

     The “go ahead and sign it” bunch should quietly move on. It’s in their own best interest. …

3. I still call it BS if any money from taxpayers is used , left pocket right pocket don’t matter
   Nobody gave me anything when I bought my property and house
   Oh that’s right they even took my homestead tax credit away , naw they didn’t
   APRIL FOOLS
   I STILL CALL IT BS IF THEY GET 1 THIN DIME

4. The clowns still hold the purse strings and spend like the revenue stream will never fall short! Who will be left holding the debt the taxpayers! Let us get a real plan with some foresight and logic.

5. To this day I have never understood how those who support whatever the city is supporting can claim that they are the ones fighting for progress and those against are just being negative. They do this every single time.

   Somehow someway they convinced themselves that anyone who opposed the demolition of Roberts AND then turning around and wasting $17.5 mil on dull, generic, and out of place ball fields were just being “negative Nancys” for not going along with that brilliant idea of wasting both the city’s basketball AND baseball history at the same time.

   And of course, they think building a completely new terrain interstate that is now inching close to the $5 billion mark when there was not one but two counter alternatives that would have saved money and satisfied all parties involved is some lighting in a bottle project.

   And who could forget that glorious consolidation proposal that wasn’t well… consolidation. It was just a power grab that had no urban growth boundaries in it, didn’t merge police and sheriff, and would have ended up costing sewer acustomers in the city about 35% more.

   So now, who in the world would be surprised that these same yes people would be all giddy about a hotel plan regardless if it’s $20 million or $37.5 million, a figure that was nearly double the current plan for basically the same thing minus a few bells and whistles?

   I really wish people in this town would look at projects like these from an independent perspective and not just jump on something someone or some organization has told them to support. I also feel like no one is evaluating the opportunity costs of any of these projects either. Freeing up an additional $17.5 million gives the city much more funds to go after another project on the 01 downtown master plan.

   But I guess I’m just being negative and anti-progress on a “tabloid newspaper” to suggest that that these additional funds are a good thing right?

   • I agree with your opinion on the use of the word “progress”. Most times it’s political bullying at its worst. Who appointed anyone to think that their opinion is “progress”? That’s why I finished the thought in my Facebook page title. I wanted progress on that specific item, i.e. to move forward. The term “progressive” when describing people is narcissistic.

     • I can agree and support your post. I appreciate all the work you are doing for this community!

6. As for the idea of including Old North H.S in a package deal for the IUMS, there’s only one reason and one reason only why it wouldn’t happen. And that’s because of the downtown power brokers don’t want it out of their area.

   Both the ERBC and Chamber are working on this so like everything else they will cram it in a location it doesn’t belong in just to satisfy their own goals.

   Downtown is getting fair representation and the sprawling I-164 corridor is getting fair representation, but once again Jacobsville & the Old Hercules Business 41 corridor are left with no arms in a power struggle even though these are both bedroom communities of downtown. And this is EXACTLY why both of those areas have been allowed to detoriate to the point of no return. The city had no motivation to do anything about any of these areas because it wouldn’t satisfy their buddies, their pals.

   The sad part is, is that this may be one of the last chances to really transform the area. I know Mr. Ron Cosby is both a huge supporter of fighting the blight in the third ward and north downtown areas. I also know he’s a big fan of selling Old North. I, myself, am a fan of reusing the historic Old North Gym. This is a golden opportunity to do both.

   I think when the city looks back, this will be just one more time when the people around here say that the way things used to be done made more sense than how they are done now. Converting Rex Mundi into Ivy Tech was a brilliant idea.

7. Joe–I am glad as well as most other people in town that Evansville is going to get a much needed convention hotel.

   You state above “…the reality is that we, “against” team, and six practical minded members of the Evansville City Council drug the long time support it at any price group kicking and screaming into a palatable deal”

   How about giving everyone some credit for getting the job done including the Mayor, ONB and HCW.

   Thanks to everyone.

   • We have been open about this being a team effort that could not have happened without a fight. We have also been very open that without the fight the 4 day effort by the Mayor, ONB, and HCW to salvage a dead deal would have never happened. How about this Wayne. If the Mayor will openly acknowledge the significant role played by the CCO, the “against” page, and the other skeptics who persevered through threats and name calling to force the “support at any price” group to go out and exceed their own expectations to get a better deal for the people of Evansville, we shall openly acknowledge his newly developed talents and encourage him to use them in all future negotiations.

     • Sounds pretty fair to me. I mentioned the Mayor’s newly found negotiating skills in my remarks on Monday.

     • Elected officials are elected to represent the will of the people. It finally became very clear to certain political officeholders their no vote was not the will of the people they were elected to represent. The overwhelming vast majority of the public (made up of both parties), labor organizations and the business organizations strongly supported both hotel deals albeit the last one is better.

       • bull:

       • This is a cross section of the same cast of characters who put President Obama in the White House. Just because a majority of lemmings want to follow their leader down a wrong path does not make it the right thing to do. Luckily Evansville had six elected officials with the brains and will to prevent the herd from following the pied piper down the path to unsustainability

         • 🙂

       • Saying that an overwhelming majority supported the hotel over and over again will never make it true. The Mayor caved and scrambled to work up a better deal after he realized his lazy assed good for only a few political cronies and HCW deal was dead. It didn’t become clear to the City Council members, it became clear to the Mayor. No telling how much better of a deal the City could have gotten if he and others weren’t negotiating against themselves.

       • It is a mass majority in your mind. How can you support spend and tax. How can you cheerlead for and claim to be a republican. You are blinded by the chance of finally winning something!

   • I’ll give credit to Winnecke for a hotel project that ended up being in the range the NOs were asking for and not in his when he takes responsibility for how he handled Roberts and how he treated its supporters. Deal?

   • The mayor and those like yourself who opposed the efforts of those who worked to stop the $37.5 million deal do not deserve any credit or thanks you for saving $20 million.

     In fact, they deserve questions as to why they had to be dragged away from the $37.5 million deal and how they came to this new deal in 72 hours. Yes, I will admit that there was some amazing financial acrobatics, but I repeat my question to the mayor, “What took you so long?”

     The only reason this deal took place is because your side was left with nothing, not because your side was being good trustees of of the public’s interest.

     To me it appears that those supporting the original deal were either inept or corrupt.

     Also, this “much needed hotel” is a manufactured need which resulted from bad decisions of destroying Roberts stadium and building a poorly planned arena as part of the “save downtown” mantra. Downtown will not be “saved” until we fix what killed it, building a civic center across it.

     So while I credit the mayor for an amazing last minute end run, and I am encouraged by the results, I do not thank any of those who supported the original deal. In fact, I wonder if it is going to be necessary to have hawk eyed watch groups watching every endeavor of this leadership.

     • +1

   • Did the mayor, ONB, and, HCW just hear about the hotel deal? They would have been happy, make that giddy, with the taxpayers paying for the whole thing, they stepped up ONLY when it was evident the proposal wouldn’t fly. Taking credit for doing a good job only because you were forced into it is narcistic.

8. Is there a problem with the server not working some of the time? I’m wondering if it’s over loaded at times. Some times I get a error message that this site can’t be displayed. Is any one else getting these type of error message too when they try to read or open this web site?

9. Google Chrome seems to work better for me.

10. I installed a few programs yesterday that wanted me to install Google Chrome with them but I unchecked the check boxes and left them out of the install I was really wanting.

    I’ve never tried Chrome before. I started out using the original internet browser (Fire Foxes earlier version before it was called Fire Fox) and then switched to IE and never looked back. I used Fire Fox for certain things so maybe now I’ll use Chrome if I’m the only one getting these internet glitches while visiting this forum.

    I’d like to know what Phillis thinks that the old 37.5 million dollar deal was good for her? What’s her interest in this deal. Does she stand to make some money off the deal? She sure sounds like that to me. I mean only those that could make more money off that deal that they would pay extra in taxes down the road would be in favor of it. Does she have an investment in the bars around the Ford Center or a eating establishment on main street and think that she can use the tax payers money to attract more business to her bar or eatery? She must have a angle on this to be such a big supporter, no matter how much of the basically ,free to her, tax money is used

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