IS IT TRUE May 13, 2015

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IS IT TRUE that the Indiana General Assembly graciously bestowed upon our fair City $25.2 million for a new I U Medical School and in return the taxpayers of Evansville are required to drag their credit card to the tune of $57 million dollars?

IS IT TRUE that the Indiana Senate’s love for Evansville’s Ivy Tech is less then stellar and in the wake of their academic elitism, sliced 1,700 Ivy Tech medical professions students from the Indiana University Medical School?  …that our quiet little City on the banks of the Ohio finds that 50,000 square feet has been eliminated from this project?  … that the taxpayers of Evansville will still fork out $57 million dollars towards this project or will be subsidizing 70%  of the project even after cutting the size of the building?

IS IT TRUE that Mr. Winnecke deflected the failure of making IVY Tech a part of this project by saying, “Ivy Tech has issues at the State level” ?  …additional research would had discovered that IVY Tech has an outstanding job placement record of Medical students after graduation?

IT IS TRUE that if the Indiana University Medical School  project is reduced from 170,000 square feet to 120,000 square feet the City’s contribution should be reduced accordingly?

IS IT TRUE that once this fabulous facility becomes reality, the City of Evansville will NOT own the I U Medical School property?  …Its alleged  that local contractor Shanska-Evansville will have 100% ownership in this project after its built?   …its been alleged that Indiana University will pay rent each month on a building financed and paid for by the City of Evansville and the State of Indiana for the next 25 or 30 years to the local Build/Developer?  …does this transaction make any sense at all?

IS IT TRUE we can’t wait to read your views on this transaction?

Please take time and vote in todays “Readers Poll”. Also we just posted our current TRI-STATE VOICES TV show. This weeks guests are Courier and Press political reporter Zack Evans and Channel 25 reporter Jordan Vandenberge discussing the primary election results. This is a must view program.

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65 COMMENTS

  1. Wait… the city and state would pay the entire cost to build it and the builder would collect rent on top of that from a public institution? If this is true there should be Baltimore style rioting. You’ve got to be kidding? What Mike Pence crony owns this building contractor?

    • Of course, here comes Santa LLoyd, here comes Santa Lloyd . . . step right up and getcha some . . .is the motto . . .while we the taxpayer touch our toes . . nice to know that Evansville’s new name is catchin on . . .Suckersville . . . and the mayor’s new name Santa Lloyd is also catchin on . . .naturally, the circle can not be complete until the mayor’s lovely bride Christmas Carol and their Chief Elf, Kelley Courses . . .makes their entrance . . and the question of day? Where in hell do they park the sleigh and the raindeer??? maybe the vacant lot where the hotel alleged will be built . . .

      • And why do they say, “it’s a bad day to stop drinkin” after reading this article . . .just broke my leg fallin of the wagon . . . correction the sleigh . . . just got butted in the rear by one of Santa Lloyd’s raindeer . . . a/k/a/ Sinister Schaefer . . .Stop the presses . . .just saw Sinister polishing Rudolph’s rose . . .

        • Just like Holiday World . . .everyday is Christmas at Santa Lloyd’s workshop on the third floor room 302 Civic Center . . .

          • What is so trouble it used to be a half pint of liquor would getcha vote . . . now it is a hotel and/or Med School . . boy the price of progress under Santa Lloyd’s standards in climbing by leaps and bounds . . .

  2. Now here is a chance for Gail to show someone like me how she is different than Winnecke.

    • Your right IE– What does the Riecken Campaign have to say about this questionable “Deal”
      that, like the Motel/Hotel scam leaves the Evansville Taxpayers owing MILLIONS, but with NO EQUITY?

    • She has said she is for putting it downtown which I strongly disagree with. Not sure how she feels since this has taken on the appearance of a typical Winnecke Bait & Switch. A typical Winnecke Bad For The Taxpayers scheme, all that’s missing is Ken Haney (and Ivy Tech). I doubt that she was consulted on the location before it was set in stone. I think Shoulders took control carrying Winnecke’s preferences to the IU siting committee and that was that.

      • Her best hope is for Winnecke to pin this project on the map and have a golden shovel even or two, or three, or four, before the election. Then it becomes just another Winnecke problem she inherited.

        Our best hope is for the CC to nuke this deal which is why I say we need Winnecke and a democrat CC. If Gail is mayor and favors downtown for the school, they would not block it.

        Gail’s best move would be to start thinking out of the Downtown box and support one of the other more sensible locations. It would show me that she might actually be different and I would have to ruin Brains Benton’s day by supporting her.

      • Bandana,–beyond the questionable wisdom on the Site,–The question today is: Why is there No Equity position for the Taxpayers, who are going to be indebted to the tune of $57 Million?

        • I think it’s because as an aggregate the taxpayers are seen as an entity to be screwed. They constitute a bloc of sorts, a bloc that represents a chunk of future money to be pledged. Though not individually stupid, their votes and voices are fragmented by design. Once reduced to smaller semi-warring factions they don’t pose much of a threat to politicians who aren’t shy about lying to them and spending them under.

          I’ve personally seen plenty of Lloyd Winnecke. I can’t think of anything to recommend him or his crew. He is hurting Evansville.

          • —-> “We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens may act only by permission; which is the stage of the darkest periods of human history, the stage of rule by brute force.” <—-

            (Ayn Rand)

        • Why. . . because we have Santa LLoyd and his jolly Christmas Carol in toll . . . never seen such bs in my life . . .and now we discover that Tucker is in the mix . . .like one of the bloggers indicated. . . .new name has to be Suckersville. . .Hollywood can not script this crap any better. . .like Chevy Chase said, ” where in the hell is the tylenol “. . .” Scotty, please beam me up, apparently there isn’t any intelligent life sources on this planet”. . .

  3. Before the medical school is done morphing it’ll fit in a couple of rooms at our grand new Pancaked Hilton. The price to us will remain the same or possibly go up.

  4. If this is true it’s a bigger sweetheart deal than the hotel. The peasants are too busy working their low wage RTW jobs to care, though. All part of the Republican plan.

    • Ghost, give it a rest. Must every comment include a jab at the right/Republicans? Many Republicans are against this med school project and the downtown hotel in their current forms. It’s not a partisan issue – it’s a common sense issue – which is apparently lacking.

  5. IS IT TRUE that once this fabulous facility becomes reality, the City of Evansville will NOT own the I U Medical School property? …Its alleged that local contractor Shanska-Evansville will have 100% ownership in this project after its built? …its been alleged that Indiana University will pay rent each month on a building financed and paid for by the City of Evansville and the State of Indiana for the next 25 or 30 years to the local Build/Developer? …does this transaction make any sense at all?

    Sounds like the same SENEGAL deal with the Evansville, IN Downtown Hotel. City pays the vast majority of the money to build the thing and retains Zero interest in the building. Who thinks of this crap?

    • This is why when the word came that the downtown was selected as the IUMS site, Santa Lloyd’s face lit up like a christmas tree. . .remember the circle atmosphere in the ONB cathedral. . . he resembled the likes of the last Power Ball winner. . . Santa has come a long ways since his theater days at Central H.S. . . but nowadays, everyday is a stage event . . .

  6. Editor: are you saying the $ 57 Million of City’s expense EXCLUDES the work Skanska will perform; and the ownership of the development is Skanska’s ‘sweat equity’ which entitles them to a rent payment ? If that is true, then that is a foolish arrangement for the City. Once the developer owns it, the rent will be in perpetuity–and will greatly exceed the cash price at time of construction. Need more facts on this . . .

    • Green_Light. If this is true it’s more than a foolish arrangement. It should be criminal. You are right: we need more facts.

      • The Editor is a bit off today. The med school will be approximately 180k square feet without Ivy Tech. The Ivy Tech portion was approximately 40k square feet and would have taken the building to about 220k square feet. The 57 million is 15 million for acquisition, site work, engineering; 5 million for payments on the debt during construction; and 37 million for the 180k square foot building. Ivy Tech was going to pay for the expansion of 40k square feet through the legislature funding it. There is no reduction in the bond without Ivy Tech, because the Ivy Tech square footage was never in the bond to start.
        Skansksa will not own the medical school building. It will be owned by a consortium that includes US Health Realty and our trusted servant Tucker real estate. The tenants will have a lease and pay for their occupancy.
        Schools don’t pay property taxes, so there is no benefit to the tax payer outside of the projected economic development to the area- more people living and spending money in Evansville. Unless of course, they already happen to live here and spend their money. Then it’s just a shifting of the dollars. Sandwich shops on the west side or First Avenue may close or lose business that moves downtown.

        • Tao, playing devil’s advocate . . . why would U.S. Health Realty and Tucker Real Estate (employer of Mayor’s wife) have any involvement with the ownership of the IU Med School real estate ? So what if these two firms are going to ‘pay for their tenancy’. When the new and improved IU Med School is built in 2040, these two entities own a property free and clear for which they did not pay anything (except their own office rents) ! Sounds like fraud to me. Why can’t the City own the IU Med School (or even IU own it) ????

          • I don’t mean that US Health Realty and Tucker will pay rent. They will collect it. The City for whatever reason sees a benefit in not owning the property. Owners have liability and are responsible for capital investment and repairs, etc. The City opted out of any of that. US Health Realty and Tucker will own the property and balance revenue versus expenditures. IU, U of E, USI and potentially Ivy Tech will be the tenants. This way the schools don’t have to deal with liability or upkeep either.

          • @Tao:

            What a crock of shit–City doesn’t want to own it/ so Mayor’s wife’s firm jumps in to ownership role (for free) ?

            Since Councilman Missy Mosby is employed by Tucker Real Estate–the designated future owner of the Med School–shouldn’t the Council’s vote on the $ 57 Million be voided due to a conflict of interest ??????

        • @Tao of Pooh:

          If your version of the facts are correct , then I am guessing that Gail Riecken will like this a lot–from the perspective that this ownership of the real estate deal is so corrupt, and understandable even to the average citizen, that it assists her immeasurably in getting elected as our new Mayor !

          • What is corrupt I think is Tuckers way of getting its hands in all the pies. They are like a 12 handed man at a pie giveaway who got to be first in line. They have definitely been a partner to this administration. If there’s real estate bought or sold related to the City they are typically, although not always, the broker. Their commercial brokers have really made out. The question really is whether Carol McClintock is an equity partner and gets a piece of the overall profit of the company. I suspect Carol’s personal income has doubled. She has probably more than made up for whatever cut Lloyd took to be Mayor.
            The reality though on the medical campus is that it will cost money to own and operate. We as a City are not that great at making money on anything we own and operate- Roberts Stadium, Ford Center, Victory Theater, Mesker Amphitheater, Innovation Pointe, Swonder Ice Arena, all of the pools, etc. It may be better for someone else to role with those punches. We run stuff like it’s never going to wear out or need replacement money.

        • Tao, article in C & P on 1-7-14 said:

          City has signed Development Agreement with US Health Realty/Skanska, ” a pending LLC”. City attorney Ted Ziemer said this was the only group to formally respond to the request for qualifications.

          Skanska DOES have its mitts in the pie after all . . . .

          • These companies are developing and building the structure. I don’t know what LLC they formed. There’s nothing on the SOS website with “health realty” or “skanska” that is new. They may or may not have an ownership interest. More will be revealed when the real estates closes.

    • STOP THE PRESSES. . .it gets worse. . .the city will not have a soft second mortgage in place . . .allowing the shell company to sale the project based on the rent rolls . . .happy days will be here for the caviar eaters. . .

  7. Who’s going to pay the property taxes on the new IU Medical School in Evansville, IN?

  10. IIT…. that the taxpayers of the city of Evansville are possessed of unlimited wealth, and that what ever the city fathers desire, the taxpayers of the city must provide? IIT…. that such thinking can only lead to bankruptcy?

  11. Skanska/ City of Evansville re: Medical School:

    Has a DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT already been signed between these two parties. If yes, that would be a public document. Can someone post a copy of the Agreement ?

  13. Today’s IIT is laughable. The Evansville taxpayers are buying land, paying to have a contractor build an IU medical school facility on it, and then giving it to the contractor to collect rent?
    Where is the link to the contract allowing this to become reality so the wording and signatures can be scrutinized?

  14. Editor et al:

    IIT loves to throw flames and stir the pot. I have taken the time to review the original information on the RFP given out for potential developers to bid on the IU medical center in Evansville. There were four proposals presented to the IU Trustees for their consideration. The IU Trustees made the decision of which proposal was to be accepted, and each proposal had separate site locations included. We have a local attorney, Pat Shoulders, who sits on the IU Trustee Board. Pat stated he had an opinion where he would like the school to be located, yet remained silent in the process and remained unbiased during the selection process. In the proposal of the downtown location, there were TIF incentives. These incentives are commonplace in Evansville and other Indiana projects. The TIF is not and never will be an equity position and for demands and questions to be asked WHY NOT is typical for the mayor and downtown haters on the CCO and the editor. The facility will be owned and or leased by IU. The RFP must be amended by the IU Trustees to meet the financial requirements of the State of Indiana. The four proposals were to be made public once a contract was signed and I would guess that no contract has been signed due to the first step in the process was the funding by the state. If each of the hate mongers, who linger at this site, sat on the Board of Trustees, you would have been given the right of helping decide where, how, and when this project is completed. As noted, in various articles and discussions, the IU Trustees talked to students, educators, the IU President, and others, with significant weight given to the students, on where they preferred the location to be. THEY wanted to be downtown, not where the readers of the IIT think personally it should be.

    Ok, your bitching, moaning, complaining may continue…..

    • The Old downtown “Haters” as you call those who dare to ask questions, has it’s basis for questions not in Hate, but in the fact that the RED INK continues to flow out from EVERY project that has dipped into the public treasury in the name of saving Old downtown—indeed these Failures drive the Taxpayers to bitch, moan, and complain and justly so, Old downtown has proved to be a rat hole for public moneys and a major Cause of an approaching unsustainable debt load thrust upon on the shrinking populace.
      “Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive”–Sir Walter Scott.

      • Addendum: If you want to term the posters on this site as haters,–a ridiculous charge,
        –then you sir –are nothing more than a boot licker.

    • Give me a break, gimmeabreak. The TIF funds of which you speak, such as they are/aren’t, are already dedicated to other projects. In fact, D PAT was part of the TIF zone for the Ford Center. Who’s going to make up the loss of funds due to their moving?

  15. $10 says the people who are going to benefit from this theft laugh at poor people and talk about lazy people on food stamps. Keep sucking on that public tit, hypocrites.

    • What’s been overlooked is during the last CC meeting Mr. K.C was making a case for some much needed improvements in the high rise ” Crab shacks ” inside those models of the the downtown B.S. sites for the labor based bid down short sheeted motel , and the similar short sheeted IU medical studies extension school. Who else besides our data base remembers the administration sporting the idea those buildings could be converted to student housing? Ah, the demise, what’s that really all about? And how will that city provide the increased square footage for those that could be displaced by this side bar Rouge? Where is this really going? “Crab shack’s for progress ?”…… its likely, the expectation of the IU medical extension campuses downtown rouge is preposterous and absolutely a burden on those whom are taxed forward to support such abhorrent plan.
      Which in itself is more pure unadulterated BS. When observed from afar.

      ab·hor·rent
      abˈhôrənt,abˈhärənt/Submit
      adjective
      inspiring disgust and loathing; repugnant.
      the site selection was abhorrent to us all”
      synonyms: detestable, hateful, loathsome, despicable, abominable, execrable, repellent, repugnant, repulsive, revolting, disgusting, distasteful, horrible, horrid, horrifying, awful, heinous, reprehensible, obnoxious, odious, nauseating, offensive, contemptible

      “he continued express the incursions onto the citizens was abhorrent”

  16. v
    May 13, 2015 at 4:08 pm

    Article sported under the editor’s of the old CCO—-> https://city-countyobserver.com/the-evansville-regional-business-committee-river-city-illuminati-or-just-good-ol-boys/ Brad Linzy They ran him outta town as well.

    http://cdn01.dailycaller.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/fingerinthepie-e1331733697240.jpg
    ======================================================================================

    I like Yoda’s over under bet on Winnecke’s claim about 250 full time jobs. Yoda predicted less than 100 jobs.

    He was correct(never say right) there ARE LESS than 100 jobs, there are ZERO jobs.

    WINNECKE = FAILURE = WINNECKE

  17. That is horrid , its nothing more than shit bird logistics. How the hell can anyone justify a solution? jus·ti·fy
    ˈjəstəˌfī/Submit
    verb
    r/. 1. show or prove to be right or reasonable.
    “the person appointed has fully justified our of public confidence”?
    synonyms: give grounds for, give reasons for, give a justification for, explain, give an explanation for, account for ?

  18. It seems that there are very important facts about this project that are being withheld. The taxpayers and citizens of Evansville usually discover the truth after the deal is done – and can’t be changed. Law suits cost too much $$ and emails go missing. Information is selectively released by the administration.
    It is difficult to trust that this project will benefit all of Evansville. If completed it will certainly benefit a select few.
    With the other debts the city is dealing with how does spending $57 million make sense?

    • Simply put Teach the project is lining up to be just more localized cronies fueling.
      The place cannot afford it, and IU will be caught up in the final aberration.

      ab·er·ra·tion
      ˌabəˈrāSH(ə)n/
      noun
      a departure from what is normal, usual, or expected, typically one that is unwelcome.
      “they described the outbreak of violence in the area as an aberration”
      synonyms: anomaly, deviation, departure from the norm, divergence, abnormality, irregularity, variation, digression, freak, rogue, rarity, oddity, peculiarity, curiosity, quirk; mistake
      “a statistical aberration”
      BIOLOGY
      a characteristic that deviates from the normal type.
      “color aberrations”
      synonyms: anomaly, deviation, departure from the norm, divergence, abnormality, irregularity, variation, digression, freak, rogue, rarity, oddity, peculiarity, curiosity, quirk; mistake

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